Monday, September 19, 2011

Mo is King of the Hill

So to very little fan fare from the media types, Mariano Rivera did today what he had done 643 times prior to today - succesfully close a game out with absolutely no emotional quotient. Just punching the clock.

Except this time as we all know he did it to pass Trevor Hoffman as the all-time leader.

While I have no doubt this record will stand for at least the next 10 to 15 seasons - I'm not sure I would put this in the untouchable category. AT least not yet. It is too new of a stat to know if anyone will get close to this.

Mo stays at it for 2 maybe 3 seasons, close in on 700, and then we just wait and see. But a lot things need to line up for a decade and half for some pitcher out there to get in the conversation.

1st ballot HOF? Probably. Class guy, ambassador for the game and the biggest stage.

If the saves record is not untouchable what is? Strikouts, Career Wins, and Consecutive Games Played.

I do believe the all time hits record will be broken, and the 56 game hitting streak I think will get done at some point by an Ichiro type player.


I know this post is dedicated to Mo, but not for not nothing - how about the Sox melting down the stretch??!!

Love it.


Crash said...

I think Mo has a very realistic shot at 700 saves. If he can stay healthy, which for the most part he has, minor stints on the DL but nothing significant, and he remains effective, which appears he isn't slowing down this year. Though with closers the end can come quick. Which makes this achievement even more impressive. There are graphics that show he is leaking into more of the plate with his pitches over the last couple of seasons, but it hasn't resulted in anything disparaging in the way of performance.

I love that even when Sportscenter celebrates this historical achievement, they mention 70 saves against Baltimore, his most against any one team, but then in the same breath mention his 14 blown saves against the Red Sox, most against any one team. What they didn't mention is his 54 saves against Boston, which is 3rd highest against any one team (Baltimore at 70, Tampa 56, Boston 54). Pretty impressive given Boston has been pretty damn good for about half of Mo's career. Think about it...14 blown saves against Boston for his career. That's less than 1 blown save a year against them. Against arguably the best team outside of New York. He only blows about 5 saves a year.

Mo should be the first player to receive 100% of the votes for HOF. Especially if he does get to 700. If he doesn't get 100% that writer should be removed from having a HOF ballot.

Yankees magic number down to 4 for a playoff birth and 5 for the AL East.

old professor said...

Mo's record will stand the test of time. Put it in perspective - a reliever would have to have 15 years of 40 saves per year just to get to 600. I do not believe you will see the durability that will allow that kind of run. Look at the top five closers of all time. Mo has 602 and counting; Billy Wagner is fifth with 426 saves. Four of the top five are no longer active. It would be interesting to know who the active number two saves leader is behind Mo. Knowing that will give you an idea of how untouchable the record is.

The sad thing is the team and YES Network put more into Jeter's 3000 hit chase then Mo's chase of career saves - lets put it in a better light - how many of Jeter's 3000 hits were responsible for victory. Mo's saves led to 602 wins for the team in regular season. I am not belittling Jeters achievement, but I find it somewhat hard to believe the difference in the coverage by the teams own network.

Ten games left in the season - Yankees only have to go .500 and Sox have to win them all.

MId said...

In regards to coverage of Jeter's 3,000 hits vs. Mo's Save Record I was wondering the same thing, but after I heard the following rationale I find myself agreeing with it and think the reduced coverage was justified.

Hits have been around since the begining of the game - we know what hits are - and how many people have a chance for a hit, yet less than 30 of them have amassed 3,000 of them.

On the flip side - saves are a new stat - and has some odd rules as to what is a "Save" and what is not. Saves meant different things for different eras of the sport. Who knows how a save will play into the game in the future.

So, 3,000 hits deserves more coverage - I think the understated saves record is impressive, but also matches Mo's understated personality.

Mid said...

On a side and unrelated note - even though the G-Men won - Eli looks terrible two weeks into the season and is not even the best QB on the team.

Bench him now and bring in David Carr!!!

Crash said...

First...stop blaming Eli. Blame the GM for not replacing the players that left. He has no tools to work with.

Second and more importantly, Yankees beat the Rays so I believe their playoff magic number is down to 2. So a win tomorrow and Yankees are in. Boston loses to Baltimore. If Boston loses tomorrow and Yankees win that should give them the division title as well.

Crash said...

I should clarify that the Yankees can clinch the division because it's a day/night double header. So they would need to sweep coupled with a Sox loss.

old professor said...

Mid, your argument is hollow. As you put it there are only thirty guys with 3,000 hits. BUT only two pitchers have 600 saves. The save stat has been around for a long time, however it become an official state about 35 years ago. Yankees had a relief specialist in 61 that saved 20 games for Whitey Ford. They have had Luis Arroyo (first real fireman), Hal Reniff, Sparky Lyle, Goose Gossage, Dave Ragetti, Wetland and now Mo. The team has all of their statistics whether it was official for MLB or not - and only one of the gues mentioned has 600 saves - Mo.

Noesi is pitching the first game of the double header and appears to be doing well through the first two innings.

Crash said...

With Niesi already out of the game (2 2/3 IP) I'm hoping Betances and Brackman get into this game.

Crash said...


With both Sox and Rays going in the tank the Angels may be the team to win the Wild Card. I'll take that matchup, while Weaver has a winning record against the Yankees he has an ERA around 6 in Yankee Stadium. Also consider just took a line drive off his wrist.

old professor said...

I was a great game to watch. It was ironic that Posada gets the hit that wins the game and seals the division championship.

It is also ironic that the Yankees tied the first game against Shields and then won it against a reliever brought in to go lefty on lefty. Nightcap, they struggle against Hellickson getting two hits through seven innings and then win it against the Rays bullpen.

I am not sure I like the match up Yankees versus Angels. It may end up the lesser of evils for the Yankees to play them. I don't think they match up well against the Tigers and they have had issues with Texas. Hopefully the rotation gets healthy and rested for the run.

Brackman was actually warming up yesterday during game one with Mo. If the game remained tied, Brackman would have probably come in. I would expect to see some of the triple A call ups this week more and more now that the division is at hand. (Yankees need only one more win to clinch home field advantage).

old professor said...

On a non-baseball related issue, the Giants lose another player (Hixon) to a torn ACL - that makes at least four and possibly five to go down with the same problem - Maybe it is time to review the turf issue at the stadium.

Crash said...

I would expect tonight's line up to look more like a Scranton or spring training lineup. Now we will see Brackman, Betances, et al. I would expect more complete lineups for the Sox series. Simply because it's the rivalry and the Yankees don't want to see the Red Sox in the post-season. If Beckett and Lester get hot they can roll right through any series.

That being said I take great pleasure in the fact that the Red Sox spent $370+ million on the Beckett extension, Gonzalez extension, and signing Crawford. And everyone was predicting World Series when here they are in their usual position, looking up at the Yankees in the AL East and fighting for a playoff spot. I rarely root against a team, even the Red Sox, but this time I'm really hoping they choke it away and miss the playoffs completely.

Crash said...

So that Betances debut didn't go so great...2/3 IP, 2 ER, 0 H, 4 BB. At least Brackman didn't give up any runs. Think he only had 1 H.

Not a pretty game tonight. I think there were 4 errors.

old professor said...

Betances looked overwhelmed on the mound and he seemed to rush his pitches. Not the way you would anticipate a debut - three walks and a hit batter.

Brachman got out of a jam and did not seem to be caught up in the moment.

Four errors - two by Jeter sealed what was going to be a really sloppy game. Proctor also didn't help his value by giving up four runs on two very long home runs.

Crash said...

Proctor is a mess...I think last nights performance may have pushed his season era to over 7. He should have been brought in around the 8th inning of last nights game, not when the Yankees still had a reasonable chance.

Red Sox series starts tonight, weather is going to play a big factor. And no way the games don't get played with the Red Sox hanging on to a playoff spot by thread. Yankees have a chance to win 2 of 3. AJ is lined up with a good match up (Wakefield I think). Sunday's game has a TBD for the Sox, it could be Beckett on short rest. Tonight I think it is Lester vs. Garcia. Lester has struggled in his last two starts, giving up 4 runs to the Rays on consecutive losing efforts.

Crash said...

Story out there that Cashnan 'faked' interest in Carl Crawford just to drive up the price on the Red Sox.

Crash said...

Ever since the Yankees clinched the AL East, Girardi has been saying we are going to play every remaining game to win. Well he didn't do that last night in the night cap against the Red Sox. First he left Nova in way too long, which results in the Sox taking the lead. But then he pitches Proctor in the 14th. To say we're going to play every game to win and to pitch Proctor are contradictions.

If the Sox make the playoffs and get hot and go to the World Series by beating the Yankees, we can point to last night. That one pitching move probably sends Boston to the playoffs. That could be the entire turning point for that team. It can re-build their confidence, if they take 2 of 3 or sweep Baltimore then they go from having the worst September in team history to being hot at the right time and can roll in October.

Also I think Ellsbury won the MVP last night. He has absolutely destroyed the Yankees this year and he literally saved the Red Sox season with that HR last night. While Granderson went 0-5.

Now, for the final series, Girardi needs to keep the starters sharp without wearing them out. I think Noesi gets the start tonight, I know Hughes will be in the bullpen for the playoffs but he could get a start tomorrow, then probably Colon.

You have to assume Montero makes the post-season roster. Girardi confirms Posada is on the roster as well. I would guess that after his start yesterday AJ gets the game 3 start and Nova gets game 2.

Yankees had plenty of opportunities to win that game last night a came up empty with the bases loaded, 2 guys on, etc. They will need to find that timely hitting and come through in those situations if they went to win in October.

The Sox are pitching Beckett tonight and Lest on Thursday. This means both of their top pitchers will be going into the playoffs on short rest.

One last thing on the series...I know we're stuck with headcase AJ and his roller coaster results...but at least we don't have to put up with John Lackey. I bought into the whole "bulldog" of a pitcher the media was selling, but the more I see this guy the more I see he's just an immature jerk who is seldom happy. He shows up his manager, shows up his team when they make errors, and now lays into the media inappropriately. Low-class.

Support the Troops